• Welcome to the Land Rover UK Forums

    You are currently viewing the site as a guest and some content may not be available to you.

    Registration is quick and easy and will give you full access to the site and allow you to ask questions or make comments and join in on the conversation. If you would like to register then please Register Now

ABS pump P38 to Classic

firetruck

In Second Gear
Does anybody know any issues with using P38 ABS pump electrical motor and internal black disc on a Classic? I'm busy restoring a '92 and the ABS pump was seized which caused to motor to burn out.
After searching ebay for a week without any luck I bought a P38 pump, removed the electrical motor and grinded the foot bracket off. The bolt holes between motor and pump are a exact match, but had to use the electrical plug of old one. Dont forget about the rubber seal between motor and pump. The black internal disc doing the brake fluid pumping also was a direct replacement. Then I just had to move the bracket from the old motor to the new. So overall about 1 hour job, but now need to bleed the brakes and see if it all work fine. I assume the pressure switch is also a direct replacement if needed?
 
Can't comment on the pressure switch but they both use the same Wabco system so I would expect the pressures to be the same. The motor should be fine, a motor is a motor after all.
 
I've fitted a few p38 pumps to classics now as a kit I do. Pm me and I can give you the details. It's very little you need to do however if you have traction control you do need to modify some pipes to a tee.

james
 
Hi, new here so cannot PM, and ABS ok at the moment, touchwood, previous owner said he changed pump and accumulator, but pump looks secondhand but accumulator is new.

Planning ahead so I am prepared on ABS failure, do you have info on the P38 pump fitment onto a 1994 classic. You said you have a kit? Reading a bit it seems pipe connections etc. are different and I have TC too. No rush but I am in Norway so DIY necessary, and some parts hard to source, and thinking of buying a spare P38 pump and enough to fit it just in case. Air suspension is swopped out and SRS fault I currently have does not stop it moving, ABS fault is main remaining potential fault that stops vehicle being driven. Currently replacing 2 body mounts.........

Thanks
 
Hi,

yes its a pretty straight forward job. You need to make some extra pipework up and have a tee piece if you have TC, that's the only extra work required when that's fitted. And yes you need a hose made specially to go from the pump to the abs block.

if you email me I can get you a price to get everything you need and box it up to send over as a kit with some instructions.

My email is [email protected]

James
 
Hi, new here so cannot PM, and ABS ok at the moment, touchwood, previous owner said he changed pump and accumulator, but pump looks secondhand but accumulator is new.

Planning ahead so I am prepared on ABS failure, do you have info on the P38 pump fitment onto a 1994 classic. You said you have a kit? Reading a bit it seems pipe connections etc. are different and I have TC too. No rush but I am in Norway so DIY necessary, and some parts hard to source, and thinking of buying a spare P38 pump and enough to fit it just in case. Air suspension is swopped out and SRS fault I currently have does not stop it moving, ABS fault is main remaining potential fault that stops vehicle being driven. Currently replacing 2 body mounts.........

Thanks

I think the main thing to go wrong is the electric motor. I bought a P38 unit and changed the motor over to my classic. The electrical plug is different. So had to swap that over. 3 bolts you undo for the motor and change the bracket over. Looks completely standard and no fiddling with pipework. Obviously wont work if the actual oil pump part goes south.
 
G'Day from OZ

This thread was linked from rangerovers.net and with apologies for hijacking it, I hope you can assist with a P38 to Classic ABS conversion issue

On my 1993 Vogue SE, initially, the ABS system was erratic, then failed completely, though there is pressure if you stand hard on the pedal. The pump will not run, even with a line direct from the battery. The electrical wiring has been badly botched by the PO who even removed the code reader plug to see what is going on. Parts for the original Classic ABS are unobtainable and/or so expensive as to be non-viable.

The best option seems to be using a P38 pump and accumulator and you (also others) indicate this is fairly straightforward. I have found a unit here for around $300 which is affordable IF it works. Before I spend the money I would appreciate some practical guidance from you before I start ripping out the current unit. I have tried to contact James at J Beswick Engineering several times, but get no answer.

Someone please post some explicit directions on what needs to be done and especially if any new pipes are needed. Pictures of the current and P38 units are attached for reference

Thanks

Alan abs pump and switch.jpgP38-1.JPG
 
There is definitely an electrical problem. The wiring diagram shows that the motor wiring is quite simple - power to the 30 relay and then to the pump. The other side of the relay goes to earth, so that is very easy to fix by replacing the relay and a bit of rewiring.

Because the current motor will not run, even with a direct battery connection (positive plus ground) can anyone confirm that the motors on the two systems are identical? If so, it may be easier to exchange the motors, leaving the original pump and accumulator in place.
 
Email chap at John Beswick Engineering. Helpful chap.

Easy job, std bits, and I fitted mine on a campsite in Iceland. Doesn’t everyone carry a spare pump just in case....
 
Email chap at John Beswick Engineering. Helpful chap.

Easy job, std bits, and I fitted mine on a campsite in Iceland. Doesn’t everyone carry a spare pump just in case....

I have send 3 emails to J Beswick and had no reply. Today, I removed the 3 bolts holding the motor to the pump but have yet to undo the retaining bolts going through the wing- currently soaked in Rostof. Can you remember what the "standard" bits" were that you needed?

When I get the motor off, I'll see if it can be repaired and refitted - that will potentially save me $300 for a P38 pump, though your comment about a spare is very sensible so I might get it anyway. I'm now on my 8th Range Rover and rarely throw out any old parts - its amazing what can be made to fit in an emergency
 
It proved to be simpler to swap the pump motor and drive impeller on the existing unit using parts from the P38 unit just obtained. Also fixed several electrical problems and the motor/pump are now running. I have also found the correct plug behind the ECU where some kindly soul had hidden it so codes have now been cleared

However, I found the flexible hose from the reservoir to the pump had perished and due to its location, I'm having a terrible time trying to remove the old hose from the reservoir end and replacing it with a new hose. It would be much easier if the reservoir could be removed to do this job and it would make sense to clean out the filter while I'm at it.

Though I have been through the manual/Rave I cannot find the bolts holding the reservoir in place.

Does anyone know how to do this please?
 
Managed to remove/replace the hose from the reservoir to the pump - what a swine of a job! Typical designers/engineers did not consider the maintenance issues or they would have made the exit from the reservoir just 10 mm longer to provide better access.

However, I spoke too soon about fixing the electrical issues. There is power to the pump but I'm still getting the "3 amigos" and a 2-8 fault code. I have ordered a pair of relays in the hope they are the problem.

GLENBRITTLE - I tried to end you a PM but can't see anywhere on this forum to do so. As a worst case scenario, I may yet have to swap the pump and motor over to the P38 unit and despite your excellent instructions and pictures. I have failed the intelligence test on working out where the various connections have to go.

You say:"Very straight forward, the long pipe goes to the TC module from the top of the tee, the short pipe goes from the bottom of the tee to the abs module and finally the flexi hose goes from the tee to the pump"

Please treat me as a complete idiot and be more explicit and/or provide a sketch regarding "to the top of the module" and "from the bottom of the Tee to the ABD module" especially how these relate to the two threaded holes in the end of the P38 pump body
vogue SE connections.jpgp38_pump_fittings.jpg
 
Hello everyone,

I know it’s been a long time. i do apologise if I have not responded to emails. Sometimes they go to junk, I do check but some slip through the net.

if you need me search for James William Classics. All the contact info is there.

i still do the kits. Most go out to Canada and the states but always happy to help with Range Rover issues.

best wishes,
James
 
I've fitted a few p38 pumps to classics now as a kit I do. Pm me and I can give you the details. It's very little you need to do however if you have traction control you do need to modify some pipes to a tee.

james
I need one of those please if you still have. I need an ABS pump for a 1990 RRC
 
Hes not been on the forum for a couple of months so you best contact him via his website as he suggests;
 
Hey fam. Hope you are all well. Here to revive this topic. Is anyone kind enough to share procedure for this. Simple text message with some pictures on what to do and the simple things to look out for when putting a p38 pump to a classic. Thanks in advance
 
Managed to remove/replace the hose from the reservoir to the pump - what a swine of a job! Typical designers/engineers did not consider the maintenance issues or they would have made the exit from the reservoir just 10 mm longer to provide better access.

However, I spoke too soon about fixing the electrical issues. There is power to the pump but I'm still getting the "3 amigos" and a 2-8 fault code. I have ordered a pair of relays in the hope they are the problem.

GLENBRITTLE - I tried to end you a PM but can't see anywhere on this forum to do so. As a worst case scenario, I may yet have to swap the pump and motor over to the P38 unit and despite your excellent instructions and pictures. I have failed the intelligence test on working out where the various connections have to go.

You say:"Very straight forward, the long pipe goes to the TC module from the top of the tee, the short pipe goes from the bottom of the tee to the abs module and finally the flexi hose goes from the tee to the pump"

Please treat me as a complete idiot and be more explicit and/or provide a sketch regarding "to the top of the module" and "from the bottom of the Tee to the ABD module" especially how these relate to the two threaded holes in the end of the P38 pump body
View attachment 137549View attachment 137550
Hey. I believe you were in my same shoes at the time. Did you manage to solve this if so kindly share how you did this conversion thanks. I took my RRC to a workshop i travelled corona locked me out o travelling back for almost a year i got back and my car was robed of parts the abs pump and booster gone. I manged to get a booster but the pump is no where close and they are expensive online so i wnat to do a p38 pump on it but don't know how the plug and play goes with it. Kindly help. badly want to get my baby back on the road
 
Back
Top Bottom