LT230 in snow.

[whistler110]

Hi.

We have been getting snowed on almost every second day so far this winter and it is common for me to have to drive into work on snow covered roads. This got me thinking about the LT230's operation. The manuals that I've read say that the Transfer case should be locked when off road but what about on snow and what speeds are acceptable? I'm traveling at 80+ Km/H and so have not been locking the LT230, is this going to do damage?

I've never read anything about acceptable speeds with a locked LT230.

What happens if you leave the LT230 unlocked off road or on snow?

 

[Deleted member 2171]

The central diff-lock simply locks the rotational speeds of the front and rear propshafts. On a hard surface where you're cornering a lot, this isn't ideal as the two axles will want to run at different speeds to each other. This adds unwanted strain onto the transmission and can cause the tyres to scrub.

But if you're on snow, I imagine the surface will not give enough traction to stop the wheels spinning slightly on the surface when cornering if the difflock was engaged.

 

[toppa]

Shoould onlt be locked where there is loss of traction, so at that speed i would assume you have no loss of traction otherwise you would have slowed down.....

i think...

Cheers

 

[Deleted member 2171]

In some circumstances Toppa, the central diff-lock should be engaged before you have a loss of traction to prevent losing the traction and getting stuck or worse.

 

[nobber]

toppas spot on, it also sounds to me like he doesnt need diff lock.
really , at 80 clicks a loss of driving traction on one or two wheels wont really matter all that much and diff lock wont stop him from sliding into a tree if he loses controle.

if you cant negotiate a hill or similar driving conditions without wheel spin lock the diffs , other wise dont bother.

 

[whistler110]

Thanks for the feedback so far. When I'm doing 80 the traction is fairly good but I can still feel a tire spin for a second occasionally on the steeper hills and/or a bit of drifting in the corners.

If the snow is deeper I do lock the diff but then have to keep the speed with in 60Km/H. I'm still curios if there is a top speed for a locked LT230, I know some 4x4 systems shouldn't go over 50Km/H and in some instances I have the 110 locked when the traction gets better and I can increase the speed.

I also remember reading somewhere that it wasn't healthy for an un locked LT230 to have a lot of wheel spinning. Any truth to this?

 

[Deleted member 2171]

Nobber, what I have said comes from an off-road instructor. However I do say I'm not aware of what should be done when traveling at speed along loose surfaces. I have to disagree about what you said to do with sliding, as all the power will go to the easiest wheel to spin if difflock is disengaged. At least when its engaged the power is even to both axles.

I also remember reading somewhere that it wasn't healthy for an un locked LT230 to have a lot of wheel spinning. Any truth to this?

Yes there is some truth to it. You're not to have one axle on a rolling road for example, as the front wheels won't be turning while the rear will (difflock disengaged). This puts a lot of stress on the centre diff as it is working beyond what it should be doing.

 

[landydoctor]

Dont lock it when youre doing 80kph....the benefits of a locked diff will not make the slightest bit of diffrence.
A locked diff will not stop you sliding rich you can still slide with both axles going at the same speed.

Oh and there's no problem with putting one axle on a rolling road either...providing that you remove one prop.. Land rover tell you to do this in the instructions

I wouldn't bother putting the lock on....I've driven my dads 90 through peatbogs and on sheet ice and i've only ever used the lock twice...and that was only as a precaution on a wet bog pulling out a little fergie tractor.

I'd be having word with that instructor rich...he might need to read up on how a diff works

 

[Deleted member 2171]

Dont lock it when youre doing 80kph....the benefits of a locked diff will not make the slightest bit of diffrence.
A locked diff will not stop you sliding rich you can still slide with both axles going at the same speed.

You -can- but I'd much rather know that at least both axles are getting equal power so that one wheel isn't going to get all the power and make matters worse.

Oh and there's no problem with putting one axle on a rolling road either...providing that you remove one prop.. Land rover tell you to do this in the instructions

Yes, but otherwise it is a problem if the prop is still fitted.

I wouldn't bother putting the lock on....I've driven my dads 90 through peatbogs and on sheet ice and i've only ever used the lock twice...and that was only as a precaution on a wet bog pulling out a little fergie tractor.

Tyres can make a huge difference too as to whether or not it is required.

I'd be having word with that instructor rich...he might need to read up on how a diff works

So you're saying it's better to use a cure when you're suffering from a problem rather than prevent it in the first place?

 

[callum]

What happens if you leave the LT230 unlocked off road or on snow?

you get stuck

i'm not sure of the definitive answer. having driven up a snowy hill without diff lock i can say a lot of energy was wasted. i had been recommended to leave it unlocked to make steering easier, but locking it made driving awhole lot easier. i presume the leaving it unlocked thing was more for a front diff rather than centre.

if your doing 80 kph i can presume there's no traction issues, but i can undertand that they will arise and its not as if you can hot shift an lt230 in and out of diff lock.

transfer box shouldn't be able to wind up if the ground is slippy enough and i'm not sure if lockign it would cause heat issues at speed. i cant see how but stand to be corrected.

trouble is britain aint very snowy and roads are gritted anyway. where its less likely to be gritted and more likely to be snowy, out in the sticks, its unlikely that you'll be going very fast as the roads are narrow and twisty.

what do folk normally do nearby with yank trucks? do they leave it in 4wd all the time when its snowing? that would probably answer your question as they'll face the same issues giogn into 4wd as you will locking up the centre diff.

 

[nobber]

try driving without diff lock , if it drives ok , don't use it , you don't need it.

if your in the conditions that might require diff lock you shouldn't be driving at 80kph.

Rich , driving at 80 kph you would be surprised at just how little traction you actually do have , diff lock probably wont make a blind bit of difference should the vehicle start to slide.

the issue here i think is , is the box up to doing the speeds as we have already concluded the roads surface is slippery. like i said , try it without , see if there is a difference , if not don't use it.

 

[adafish]

Dont lock it when youre doing 80kph....the benefits of a locked diff will not make the slightest bit of diffrence.
A locked diff will not stop you sliding rich you can still slide with both axles going at the same speed.

Oh and there's no problem with putting one axle on a rolling road either...providing that you remove one prop.. Land rover tell you to do this in the instructions

I wouldn't bother putting the lock on....I've driven my dads 90 through peatbogs and on sheet ice and i've only ever used the lock twice...and that was only as a precaution on a wet bog pulling out a little fergie tractor.

"I'd be having word with that instructor rich...he might need to read up on how a diff works

"....its a good job that instuctor wasn't me..i've still no idea...

 

[landydoctor]

Yes, but otherwise it is a problem if the prop is still fitted.

Tyres can make a huge difference too as to whether or not it is required.

So you're saying it's better to use a cure when you're suffering from a problem rather than prevent it in the first place?

what sort of a PLUM put one axle on a rolling road anyway!?
unless he's running with chains or studs It's still not going to make that much diffrence...

what i'm saying is you should only use it when you have to.. I could drive around all day and never use on the farm...and even then when i've found that one wheel on the axle spins the other one is never far behind loosing traction. 80kph would give enough forward momentum to maintain traction. the reason people are always complaining of clunky transfer boxes is because they use them at the wrong time under the wrong conditions. You should'nt use a transferbox with wide throttle openings in first and second..mainly because you can strip the teeth if the wheel suddnley gets traction....I'd imagine 80kph is plenty fast enough to cause some damage if the difflock receives a shock... does this make sense??

 

[Deleted member 2171]

what sort of a PLUM put one axle on a rolling road anyway!?

Someone who happens to be on this board. Not a common poster, but takes place in most events that are organised through LRUKF's board.

unless he's running with chains or studs It's still not going to make that much diffrence...

Okay then, have it your way.

what i'm saying is you should only use it when you have to.. I could drive around all day and never use on the farm...and even then when i've found that one wheel on the axle spins the other one is never far behind loosing traction.

Yes, so if one axle is losing traction doesn't it make sense to engage difflock?

80kph would give enough forward momentum to maintain traction. the reason people are always complaining of clunky transfer boxes is because they use them at the wrong time under the wrong conditions. You should'nt use a transferbox with wide throttle openings in first and second..mainly because you can strip the teeth if the wheel suddnley gets traction....I'd imagine 80kph is plenty fast enough to cause some damage if the difflock receives a shock... does this make sense??

Yes it does make sense. Now I'll shut up and let the bloody 'experts' do all the advising. Good night.

 

[Jon v8]

Don't drop yer shoppin luv !

 

[Madoobri]

:bulge: Touchy

 

[whistler110]

what do folk normally do nearby with yank trucks? do they leave it in 4wd all the time when its snowing? that would probably answer your question as they'll face the same issues giogn into 4wd as you will locking up the centre diff.

It depends on the system. My father's GMC has a hydro link for the transfer case so it doesn't matter for him. With my full size Ford Bronco the transfer case separates the front driveshaft so it is in 2wd or 4wd so not l;ike a center diff; I never run it more then 60Km/H in 4x4 to protect the Transfer Case and it will wind up if the traction is good.

Just so that my questions are clear, I'm not concerned about whether or not I will get stuck. I have been driving in snow for many years and know what I'm doing there, the 110 performs wonderfully and is normally the truck that everyone else follows when it gets realy bad.

My concern is for the longevity of my driveline.

Good replies though.

 

[Sandy M.]

....The manuals that I've read say that the Transfer case should be locked when off road but what about on snow and what speeds are acceptable? I'm traveling at 80+ Km/H and so have not been locking the LT230, is this going to do damage?

I've never read anything about acceptable speeds with a locked LT230.

What happens if you leave the LT230 unlocked off road or on snow?

AFAIK there is no maximum speed limit set for driving with the centre diff lock engaged. However that is tempered by obvious question " How fast do you really want to go when the road is icy / snow covered/?"

Engaging the centre diff lock will give improved traction when moving off and making tight turns etc, etc, and should give better control & stability during periods of engine braking.

There is the slight possibility of overheating the diff bearings if you were to use it "unlocked" over a prolonged period, with one one propshaft turning and the other stationary [ie the moving propshaft will be turning at twice the speed of the stationary one]. Again that risk is tempered by the rare chance of that scenario happening to such an extreme, that quite frankly a fried diff may be the least of your problems.

It really boils down to your own experience and gut feeling on how the car is behaving, in relation to the condition of the road surface. I suppose that we, in the UK do not get the same amount [or quantity] of snow that you may encounter, however I normally drive around in the Ninety [and previously the Disco] with the centre diff unlocked, and should I think that it is required to provide improved Traction, then I simply decelerate, pause briefly to allow the front and rear props to "synchronise" and then engage the diff lock, and continue driving as required.

To disengage the centre diff, simply move the lever to the unlocked position, and at some suitable point, the lock will simply disengage itself.

 

[callum]

With my full size Ford Bronco the transfer case separates the front driveshaft so it is in 2wd or 4wd so not l;ike a center diff; I never run it more then 60Km/H in 4x4 to protect the Transfer Case and it will wind up if the traction is good.

that kind of answers a question then, because the lt230 will wind up just like the bronco when the diff is locked, assuming, as you say, the traction is good enough. you split power 50/50 when you engage 4wd on the bronco as you do when you engage the centre diff lock on the lt230

working in your favour, however, the lt230 is pretty tough so it will take a bit of abuse.

maybe you need traction control

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?t=10854&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=180

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=216797

or a google search for haultech and traction control

i dont know if they've started making them yet

 

[Bernie]

Someone who happens to be on this board. Not a common poster, but takes place in most events that are organised through LRUKF's board.

Eh? At most events, there is a rolling road and people put one axle of their landies on it????